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	<title>Comments on: Britain&#8217;s new Highway Code. Updated but outdated &#8211; a victim of the measurement muddle</title>
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	<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/</link>
	<description>Commentary on the measurement muddle in the UK</description>
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		<title>By: michael</title>
		<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/comment-page-1/#comment-20902</link>
		<dc:creator>michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Aug 2010 12:59:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/26/new-highway-code/#comment-20902</guid>
		<description>Given that this blog is on the UK Metric Association website, I’m sure you won’t be surprised to hear me say that I think that the Highway Code suffers tremendously by continuing with it’s referral to Imperial measures. The mile, yard, foot and inch are not referred to anywhere in the National Curriculum used throughout British state education.  Nor have they since 1974.

You say that British people want Imperial, but they are not crying out for it. The new Coalition Government has set up a website, yourfreedom.hmg.gov.uk, to invite the publics views on matters that effect them. The Metric/Imperial debate has attracted some threads, but the numbers voting show that there is very little real interest. The pro-metric threads have a more favourable response than the Imperial ones. The vast majority of people in the UK shop in supermarkets which all only sell items in metric units. 

In matters relating to the road, I do believe that initially the yard should be replaced by the metre. Signs showing yards are usually positioned to refer to the meter distance anyway eg - many signs show a hazard in 110 yds, 220 yds, 330 yds etc ready to be replaced by 100m, 200m, 300m etc. Many British major routes already have marker boards positioned every 100 metres, and at 500m seperations on the motorways. Yards are a defunct measure in all other aspects of daily life - all athletic events are in metres, fabrics &amp; trimmings etc are all sold by the metre and so on. Metres are also straightforward to convert into miles, using 1600 metres - easier to remember than 1760 yards. 

In the long term, I hope we can get rid of the mile. But with the cost implications in a period of huge spending cuts, coupled with the Conservatives traditional reluctant approach to metrication, I&#039;m not holding my breath.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Given that this blog is on the UK Metric Association website, I’m sure you won’t be surprised to hear me say that I think that the Highway Code suffers tremendously by continuing with it’s referral to Imperial measures. The mile, yard, foot and inch are not referred to anywhere in the National Curriculum used throughout British state education.  Nor have they since 1974.</p>
<p>You say that British people want Imperial, but they are not crying out for it. The new Coalition Government has set up a website, yourfreedom.hmg.gov.uk, to invite the publics views on matters that effect them. The Metric/Imperial debate has attracted some threads, but the numbers voting show that there is very little real interest. The pro-metric threads have a more favourable response than the Imperial ones. The vast majority of people in the UK shop in supermarkets which all only sell items in metric units. </p>
<p>In matters relating to the road, I do believe that initially the yard should be replaced by the metre. Signs showing yards are usually positioned to refer to the meter distance anyway eg &#8211; many signs show a hazard in 110 yds, 220 yds, 330 yds etc ready to be replaced by 100m, 200m, 300m etc. Many British major routes already have marker boards positioned every 100 metres, and at 500m seperations on the motorways. Yards are a defunct measure in all other aspects of daily life &#8211; all athletic events are in metres, fabrics &amp; trimmings etc are all sold by the metre and so on. Metres are also straightforward to convert into miles, using 1600 metres &#8211; easier to remember than 1760 yards. </p>
<p>In the long term, I hope we can get rid of the mile. But with the cost implications in a period of huge spending cuts, coupled with the Conservatives traditional reluctant approach to metrication, I&#8217;m not holding my breath.</p>
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		<title>By: philh</title>
		<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/comment-page-1/#comment-20900</link>
		<dc:creator>philh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Aug 2010 07:48:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/26/new-highway-code/#comment-20900</guid>
		<description>Dear Harvey

You want clarity. That is good.

So why do you want a mess of units like miles, yards, feet, inches and miles per hour? Why so many, especially when they relate to each other with awkward numbers like 12, 3, 36, 1760, 5280, 63360?

The obvious alternative is to use metric only for both the highway code and road signs. All that would be needed is the metre, kilometre and kilometre per hour. When you consider that kilometre just means 1000 metres it is even better.

You say British people prefer Imperial. I say it is not as simple as that. They are confused over measurement because of the way things are in Britain. For example I often hear people talk in metres for short distances and lapse into miles for longer distances or talk in inches for smallish measurements and millimetres the very small. How clearly are they thinking?

If people in Britain were to allowed experience using metric properly, without the imperial clutter and without having to convert all the time they would appreciate its advantages and come to prefer it.

Yes we want clarity. For that we need a single system that everybody can understand and use. We need metric!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Harvey</p>
<p>You want clarity. That is good.</p>
<p>So why do you want a mess of units like miles, yards, feet, inches and miles per hour? Why so many, especially when they relate to each other with awkward numbers like 12, 3, 36, 1760, 5280, 63360?</p>
<p>The obvious alternative is to use metric only for both the highway code and road signs. All that would be needed is the metre, kilometre and kilometre per hour. When you consider that kilometre just means 1000 metres it is even better.</p>
<p>You say British people prefer Imperial. I say it is not as simple as that. They are confused over measurement because of the way things are in Britain. For example I often hear people talk in metres for short distances and lapse into miles for longer distances or talk in inches for smallish measurements and millimetres the very small. How clearly are they thinking?</p>
<p>If people in Britain were to allowed experience using metric properly, without the imperial clutter and without having to convert all the time they would appreciate its advantages and come to prefer it.</p>
<p>Yes we want clarity. For that we need a single system that everybody can understand and use. We need metric!</p>
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		<title>By: Harvey</title>
		<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/comment-page-1/#comment-20892</link>
		<dc:creator>Harvey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jul 2010 19:09:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/26/new-highway-code/#comment-20892</guid>
		<description>Despite being from the USA and being an Imperialist (Even if it&#039;s US customary here), does anyone think that the UK can put its highway code entirely in miles, yards, feet, inches, and miles per hour? After all, the majority of British people prefer Imperial. So if the highway code was Imperial only, would that put clarity. I think so. Now what do you people think.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Despite being from the USA and being an Imperialist (Even if it&#8217;s US customary here), does anyone think that the UK can put its highway code entirely in miles, yards, feet, inches, and miles per hour? After all, the majority of British people prefer Imperial. So if the highway code was Imperial only, would that put clarity. I think so. Now what do you people think.</p>
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		<title>By: Martin Ward</title>
		<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/comment-page-1/#comment-5826</link>
		<dc:creator>Martin Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Oct 2007 17:03:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/26/new-highway-code/#comment-5826</guid>
		<description>Ezra, the predominant use of metric in the Traffic Signs Manual reflects the fact that roads in the UK are designed, surveyed and built using metric measurements.

However, because the display of imperial units continues to be required on road signs, the manual inevitably exhibits a certain amount of awkwardness when it comes to specifying the siting of road signs showing distances - adding complications to the work of road contractors that would be unnecessary if metric signage was used.

Sometimes &quot;yards&quot; are allowed to mean metres (as is the case for road works), in other cases distances are specified in yards (leaving the conversion to the contractor), and sometimes metric distances are specified for corresponding nominal imperial distances.

e.g. page 20 of Traffic Signs Manual Chapter 4 has a table specifying the siting of approach signs indicating a reduction in the number of lanes.

distance  legend
135 m      150 yds
180 m      200 yds
270 m      300 yds
360 m      400 yds
800 m      1/2 mile

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/tsmanual/trafficsignsmanualchapter4wa4182

Generally, a variation of up to 10% is permitted between the actual distance and the distance shown on the sign. So showing a distance of 200 m as &quot;200 yds&quot; would fall within this tolerance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ezra, the predominant use of metric in the Traffic Signs Manual reflects the fact that roads in the UK are designed, surveyed and built using metric measurements.</p>
<p>However, because the display of imperial units continues to be required on road signs, the manual inevitably exhibits a certain amount of awkwardness when it comes to specifying the siting of road signs showing distances &#8211; adding complications to the work of road contractors that would be unnecessary if metric signage was used.</p>
<p>Sometimes &#8220;yards&#8221; are allowed to mean metres (as is the case for road works), in other cases distances are specified in yards (leaving the conversion to the contractor), and sometimes metric distances are specified for corresponding nominal imperial distances.</p>
<p>e.g. page 20 of Traffic Signs Manual Chapter 4 has a table specifying the siting of approach signs indicating a reduction in the number of lanes.</p>
<p>distance  legend<br />
135 m      150 yds<br />
180 m      200 yds<br />
270 m      300 yds<br />
360 m      400 yds<br />
800 m      1/2 mile</p>
<p><a href="http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/tsmanual/trafficsignsmanualchapter4wa4182" rel="nofollow">http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/tsmanual/trafficsignsmanualchapter4wa4182</a></p>
<p>Generally, a variation of up to 10% is permitted between the actual distance and the distance shown on the sign. So showing a distance of 200 m as &#8220;200 yds&#8221; would fall within this tolerance.</p>
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		<title>By: Sean Weisthal</title>
		<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/comment-page-1/#comment-5820</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean Weisthal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Oct 2007 12:33:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/26/new-highway-code/#comment-5820</guid>
		<description>FYI This more generic document:

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/trafficsigns.pdf

Mentions the trams&#039; km/h speed limit signs</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FYI This more generic document:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/trafficsigns.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/trafficsigns.pdf</a></p>
<p>Mentions the trams&#8217; km/h speed limit signs</p>
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		<title>By: Sean Weisthal</title>
		<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/comment-page-1/#comment-5819</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean Weisthal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Oct 2007 12:16:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/26/new-highway-code/#comment-5819</guid>
		<description>Some documents show distances to exact conversions of metric/imperial, some don&#039;t.  I have even noticed signs being &quot;paced out&quot;.

Here is one where conversions are made:

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/tsmanual/trafficsignsmanualchapter4wa4182

See page 21 for examples.

You may be interested in how heights are signed-up 

(See pages around 31).

There seems to be a mix - and a mix between DfT documents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some documents show distances to exact conversions of metric/imperial, some don&#8217;t.  I have even noticed signs being &#8220;paced out&#8221;.</p>
<p>Here is one where conversions are made:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/tsmanual/trafficsignsmanualchapter4wa4182" rel="nofollow">http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/tsmanual/trafficsignsmanualchapter4wa4182</a></p>
<p>See page 21 for examples.</p>
<p>You may be interested in how heights are signed-up </p>
<p>(See pages around 31).</p>
<p>There seems to be a mix &#8211; and a mix between DfT documents.</p>
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		<title>By: Ezra Steinberg</title>
		<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/comment-page-1/#comment-5811</link>
		<dc:creator>Ezra Steinberg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Oct 2007 01:35:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/26/new-highway-code/#comment-5811</guid>
		<description>The same page says that an approach sign is to be placed at 1600 m ahead of the road work with a supplementary plate of &quot;1 mile&quot;.

Is the rest of the manual similar to this? If so, metric distances are &quot;wired in&quot; throughout. In that case, all distance signs should be metric with Imperial overlays awaiting the eventual M-Day.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The same page says that an approach sign is to be placed at 1600 m ahead of the road work with a supplementary plate of &#8220;1 mile&#8221;.</p>
<p>Is the rest of the manual similar to this? If so, metric distances are &#8220;wired in&#8221; throughout. In that case, all distance signs should be metric with Imperial overlays awaiting the eventual M-Day.</p>
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		<title>By: Martin Ward</title>
		<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/comment-page-1/#comment-5798</link>
		<dc:creator>Martin Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2007 12:31:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/26/new-highway-code/#comment-5798</guid>
		<description>On many road works signs, &quot;yards&quot; do in fact mean metres.

See Traffic Signs Manual Chapter 8

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/tsmanual/chapter8/trafficsignsmanualchap8ro4180

e.g. page 74 states:

&quot;The principles for the approach signing are: ...
a &quot;road works&quot; sign with supplementary plate &quot;800 yds&quot; placed on the near side &lt;strong&gt;800 m&lt;/strong&gt; in advance of the works lead taper;
a &quot;road works&quot; sign with supplementary plate &quot;400 yds&quot; placed on the near side &lt;strong&gt;400 m&lt;/strong&gt; in advance of the works lead taper; and
a &quot;road narrows&quot; sign with supplementary plate &quot;200 yds&quot; placed on the near side &lt;strong&gt;200 m&lt;/strong&gt; in advance of the works lead taper.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On many road works signs, &#8220;yards&#8221; do in fact mean metres.</p>
<p>See Traffic Signs Manual Chapter 8</p>
<p><a href="http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/tsmanual/chapter8/trafficsignsmanualchap8ro4180" rel="nofollow">http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roads/tss/tsmanual/chapter8/trafficsignsmanualchap8ro4180</a></p>
<p>e.g. page 74 states:</p>
<p>&#8220;The principles for the approach signing are: &#8230;<br />
a &#8220;road works&#8221; sign with supplementary plate &#8220;800 yds&#8221; placed on the near side <strong>800 m</strong> in advance of the works lead taper;<br />
a &#8220;road works&#8221; sign with supplementary plate &#8220;400 yds&#8221; placed on the near side <strong>400 m</strong> in advance of the works lead taper; and<br />
a &#8220;road narrows&#8221; sign with supplementary plate &#8220;200 yds&#8221; placed on the near side <strong>200 m</strong> in advance of the works lead taper.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Sean Weisthal</title>
		<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/comment-page-1/#comment-5795</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean Weisthal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2007 12:16:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/26/new-highway-code/#comment-5795</guid>
		<description>&quot;yard&quot; marked signs are actually placed quite accurately to what the sign says - as is confirmed by DfT manuals.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;yard&#8221; marked signs are actually placed quite accurately to what the sign says &#8211; as is confirmed by DfT manuals.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel Jackson</title>
		<link>http://metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/new-highway-code/comment-page-1/#comment-5772</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel Jackson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 15:15:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.metricviews.org.uk/2007/09/26/new-highway-code/#comment-5772</guid>
		<description>Dave Brown Says:

&quot;If you ask the DfT (via your MP) why we donâ€™t go metric on the roads, the answer used to be that &gt;50% of drivers were educated before metrication, and so not changing would affect fewer people.  Now thatâ€™s no longer true, theyâ€™ve changed their excuse and say that it would be too expensive.&quot;

To know for sure how much it would really cost, all one needs to do is look at the cost the other nations endured when they metricated.  most were able to come up with unique plans that actually reduced the costs and were able to make it fairly cheap.

The excuse about &gt;50% of drivers were educated before metrication is really saying that British citizens are ignorant and can&#039;t learn anything new.  How do they justify the fact that the other countries that metricated also had a population not educated in metric, and yet the people adapted with zero consequences?

The only real reason to keep the signs in miles and yards is because it gives the imperialists hope that imperial is not only dead yet, but there is a chance, albeit slim, for an imperial revival.  Road signs in miles are a visible sign that imperial is still alive and kicking in the UK.

Another point of interest is how many of the road signs are correct to their imperial designations?  How many road signs are placed at rounded metric distances with the miles being an approximation of that distance?  How many signs stating a distance in yards is really that distance in metres?  Eg.  How many 200 yard signs really are at a 200 m distance?  Who would really know they are right or wrong?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dave Brown Says:</p>
<p>&#8220;If you ask the DfT (via your MP) why we donâ€™t go metric on the roads, the answer used to be that &gt;50% of drivers were educated before metrication, and so not changing would affect fewer people.  Now thatâ€™s no longer true, theyâ€™ve changed their excuse and say that it would be too expensive.&#8221;</p>
<p>To know for sure how much it would really cost, all one needs to do is look at the cost the other nations endured when they metricated.  most were able to come up with unique plans that actually reduced the costs and were able to make it fairly cheap.</p>
<p>The excuse about &gt;50% of drivers were educated before metrication is really saying that British citizens are ignorant and can&#8217;t learn anything new.  How do they justify the fact that the other countries that metricated also had a population not educated in metric, and yet the people adapted with zero consequences?</p>
<p>The only real reason to keep the signs in miles and yards is because it gives the imperialists hope that imperial is not only dead yet, but there is a chance, albeit slim, for an imperial revival.  Road signs in miles are a visible sign that imperial is still alive and kicking in the UK.</p>
<p>Another point of interest is how many of the road signs are correct to their imperial designations?  How many road signs are placed at rounded metric distances with the miles being an approximation of that distance?  How many signs stating a distance in yards is really that distance in metres?  Eg.  How many 200 yard signs really are at a 200 m distance?  Who would really know they are right or wrong?</p>
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